Cycle Breaking Starts With Awareness

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 0:00

When we think about the term cycle breaker, it's being able to recognize that just because this happened to this person, this person, this person doesn't mean it it stops here and full stop. And that means also literally like undoing the work, firing the brain, reestablishing a sense of clarity and connectedness to self unapologetically.

Welcome And Guest Introduction

April Snow 0:36

Welcome to Sensitive Stories, the podcast for the people who live with hearts and eyes wide open. I'm your host, psychotherapist and author April Snow. I invite you to join me as a deep dive into rich conversations with fellow highly sensitive people that will inspire you to live a more fulfilling life as an HSP without all the overwhelm. In this episode, I talk with Angelique Foyer Fletcher about learning to take care of yourself when you grew up in an environment or culture that didn't have room for your sensitivity, why simple acts of mindfulness are deeply healing, and learning to ask yourself the question, what do I need now? Angelique is a licensed marriage and family therapist and registered play therapist who helps sensitive, neurodivergent adults and caregivers heal through her four pillars of books, nature, play, and connection. As an INFJ, HSP, and NAGRAM 4, Angelique brings curiosity, ritual, and deep empathy into our work, often lighting incense or walking in nature as part of her own healing practice. For more HSP resources and to see behind the scenes video from the podcast, join me on Instagram, TikTok, or YouTube at Sensitive Strengths, or sign up for my email list. Links are in the show notes and at sensitivestories.com. And just a reminder that this episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for treatment with a mental health or medical professional. Let's dive in the Angelique, I'm so happy to have you on the podcast. Thank you. Exciting. Thank you so much for being here.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 2:33

Yes, I'm happy to be

Discovering High Sensitivity

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 2:35

here. Yes.

April Snow 2:35

Me too. So excited to talk with you. And I wonder if we could start off where we start off every episode, which is looking at your HSP discovery story. I'd love to hear how or when you realize that you're highly sensitive.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 2:48

What a great question. So, how did I discover being an HSP? It all started in high school when, you know, like many of us, we want to know who are we? What are we? You know what I mean? And so I would take a lot of personality tests. I was 15, 16, like, what am I? And I'm like, is my introvert, extrovert? That was very big, MBTI, Myers Briggs. And along the way, I noticed like I've always heard the term you're very sensitive.

April Snow 3:14

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 3:15

As well, but as more of a deficit. And but that would keep coming up in my personality tests or having sensitivity towards just my thought process and my emotions. And it wasn't until I was about 28. So about eight, six, seven years ago, I just said, wait, there's this thing called HS highly sensitive impact. Instagram, everyone's talking about it. And I'm like, I think that's me. So that's my process.

April Snow 3:46

Yeah, it's true. You have this awareness before you have the term. And there's that seeking. I resonate with that so much. What's different about me? Why am I so sensitive? You're seeking, right? And trying to figure it out. And I've heard that word too a lot. Deficit or difference or different. Yep. Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 4:05

Too much. All the labels. Thick skin. I'm like, okay, what about just feeling the vibes in the room?

April Snow 4:11

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 4:12

That's a strength. Picking up on the things that no one can feel and see.

April Snow 4:16

It's a huge strength. I don't think people realize the benefit of that. I think they take advantage of the benefits. Yes. Without actually realizing what's happening. They love our emotional connection and empathy. They love all that part. Unless it's until it gets maybe inconvenient for them.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 4:35

Correct. Man, you really, you're on it.

April Snow 4:39

It's like this part is oh, there's so many beautiful overlaps. With whoever I talk to, and it it's I don't know, it's just really beautiful to see. Oh, we all have a somewhat similar route, our journey. Yeah.

Cultural Roots And Feeling Othered

April Snow 4:53

So I wonder if we could dive in a little bit more deeply. You mentioned your emotional sensitivity. I'm wondering how your upbringing, your cultural upbringing has shaped that, shaped your identity as an HSP.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 5:04

Absolutely. I remember in grad school, I have to start with kind of this term we call location of self. So I'm a licensed marriage-family therapist. And I learned this term in grad school back in 2017 at Purdue, where they said, okay, you have to locate yourself knowing your privileges, your popular what all the identities that are marginalized or historically oppressed, if you will. But I had the opposite effect, right, April. I actually had a lot of deep-rooted connection as a Ghanaian American. So my mother is from West Ghana, so West Africa region or Nigeria. And I grew up with the food, the culture, the language, all those kind of things, right? That gave me a sense of pride, gave me a sense of belonging that really resonated with me and helped me feel grounded. However, I also grew up as a black child in the South, where there's many folks from similar populations who we look, every skinful nature can folk, as we say, who actually see as okay, I have a disconnect because of the historical oppression, racism, and all the things, right? Not tied to my, I don't know that part of me, but because you're different from me, that's when there's there's always that disconnect, that feeling of othering, if you will.

April Snow 6:23

Yep.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 6:24

And then I grew up in small town, Kansas. So add that in. Midwest is very much about being meek, mild, quiet.

April Snow 6:33

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 6:34

Don't be too loud. And that was always just a hard journey, hard space because as a gun gunning American who's very rooted in like being jovial, loud, very family-oriented, very education-oriented, those are I can locate myself, going back to that term. Locate myself as a gunning American growing up in the Midwest with Western and Southern roots. Yeah. That was also deeply influenced by inf inf superior, inferior and superior racialized inferiority going on. Anyway.

April Snow 7:10

Oh gosh, these beautiful Ghanian roots, but then you're getting pulled away from that. You know, who you really are, what's really and I just think about it.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 7:18

Where do I fit?

April Snow 7:18

Where do you fit? Exactly. And that could have been really beautiful if you could live in that as an HSP, getting to feel your big joy, and all I don't know how emotions are viewed or sensitivity is viewed, but I could just imagine there's you could take up some space, maybe, versus putting it yourself in this little tiny box.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 7:34

You bring up an interesting point, April. It's it was funny because it's not that I was actually the quiet, sensitive, shy, reserved. Oh, she has a voice, but she's not using it. Always getting that as in the classroom.

April Snow 7:50

Yep.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 7:50

Where my culture is the opposite. Again, loud, brazen, bold, all that kind of thing. And I just wasn't able to like hone in on that. Yeah. Or dare I say being encouraged or supported.

April Snow 8:03

I feel like you could have filled up that space. What stops you? Is it being in the environment you're in? Is it family? Is it teachers in the classroom? What stops you? Yeah. If you're open to sharing that.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 8:16

Absolutely. When I look back on my experience, what always stopped me was I was almost discouraged to I was encouraged to have a voice, but make sure it fits my voice. Make sure it fits doesn't because I was blunt as well.

April Snow 8:33

Uh-huh.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 8:35

So as an INFJ, the one percenters, everybody out there, autistic, you know, whatever it is. And I'm just like, okay, I hit I never had I had the capacity to I had this deep internal world, really like getting lost in there, loving kind of the narratives and all that kind of stuff. But my emotions and my brain sometimes would just feel like a scramble. And so when teachers would see me zoning out, I was a good kid because I wasn't talking. Yep.

April Snow 9:02

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 9:03

Good. People pleasing, all that kind of stuff. My trauma responsive fawning. Because guess what? There were some abandonment rooms, some rejection wounds that I experienced earlier on in my childhood. That even just having a deep-rooted identity with being of being Gunnian wasn't enough to feel seen, if that makes sense.

April Snow 9:25

Makes total sense. The sensitive, quiet ones get labeled the good kid when yes, we're quiet on the outside, but there's a storm happening inside, and you need space for that, and to be able to take those emotions somewhere for someone to check in. What's happening in there? What's going on under that quiet facade? And sometimes quiet, we're naturally quiet, but sometimes we're quiet because we're shut down.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 9:48

True. I don't know the difference sometimes. Yeah.

April Snow 9:51

Yeah, it all looks the same. Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 9:55

And when you have a parent who's not as present with their own emotions. Because take out a single parent, I gotta take care of the kids, a household. Yep. I'm overwhelmed. But then I'm also like, I my kid is fine.

April Snow 10:13

You were needing things to feed your kind of sensitive soul, your INFJ, personality. Yeah. You're not getting that nourishment. Yeah. Yeah, it's tough. I didn't have the same experience at all, but I can resonate a lot with the quietly suffering or being the good one in the chaos. And okay, we don't need to worry about you. But there's things that you need, right? To just satisfy that depth and that connection and like the strong emotionality. You also said that you're blunt naturally, which I always get excited about. Yes, HSPs can be blunt. We can be outspoken.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 10:52

Yes, that was always a I say it with just and funny now, but growing up I heard that so much. Like, Angela, she's great, she's nice, she's fun, and she could be really blunt. Yeah. But you say it in that sometimes you just kind of ah. So I would wear my emotions on my sleeve. And again, my thought process was disjointed. Just think about it. I grew up also grew up, I didn't tell you this, but I had German roots as well. So through transracial adoption, grandma, whatever. Yeah, she was spoke different languages. So I had two people in my household who didn't, whose first language wasn't English. So the thought pattern, the connection.

April Snow 11:30

There's yep, some disjointedness there.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 11:33

So then my thought process was hard sometimes to say, what am I feeling versus what am I thinking? And I just would say it.

April Snow 11:41

Yeah, you're trying to process it out loud, perhaps.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 11:44

I was a what they say, external processor. Yeah.

April Snow 11:47

Yeah, that makes sense. Just trying to put all the pieces together. But then I've heard this from a lot of HSPs, especially HSPs who come from cultures that are more outspoken, maybe more extroverted, where they feel like, oh, I can't be my sensitive self and be this maybe blunt, outspoken, or external processor. Like those pieces maybe don't fit, even though they could fit.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 12:08

It's just it, it's every difference should be embraced.

Boundaries And Healthy Confrontation

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 12:12

Like there's all there's nothing wrong with the sense of healthy confrontation. That's something that I that's a term I learned when I was taking the clinical exam, I want to say last year. And it was very interesting. I was like, healthy confrontation. What is that? That's what I thought I was doing with other people when they would get in my space or I'm overloaded or whatever. And then I'm like, I want to share with you, but then I didn't have any boundaries set up. Ah, you know what I mean? People get away with talking crazy, and then I reach my limit and it goes out.

April Snow 12:41

What's different with bound? Like if you have a boundary set up, how does that become different for you? Just for folks who may not be familiar with that.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 12:48

Yeah. Yeah. So how I look at it is like boundaries is it's like your house, right? And there's a fence around your house. And you have three different types of fences. Either you have a wooden fence where people can see, overlook, but they know not to go near. But there's a gate. The second one is a gate open, but there's no lock. Anyone can come in anytime, it's there. Yep. Like a porous boundary, if you will. You allow the boundary to happen, you don't you set the boundary, but you still let it happen. And then the last one is this fortress, this large, big thing that covers the whole house. No one can get in. And so for a long time, how I would define boundaries is just knowing that this is me loving you and loving me at the same time.

April Snow 13:27

Yes.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 13:27

This is letting you know this is where I draw the line here. This is where I recognize that I can't be in the space. Like what you're saying, what you're doing to me is affecting kind of our connection. And so this is me lovingly confronting you.

April Snow 13:41

Yes.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 13:43

And letting you know that the this is the fence, this is protected property. Yeah, and to ensure our friendship, co-worker relationship, romantic relationship, whatever, it's important to establish that.

April Snow 13:55

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 13:56

And sometimes you have to shift those boundaries.

April Snow 13:58

Yeah, they can be, they can change. Right? Person to person, moment to moment.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 14:04

But they have to be established. And it's not the job of the person. Toxic people typically will feel entitled to ignore it. Dr. Adam Grant said that. He's a great IO psychologist. Toxic people typically feel entitled to ignore your boundaries, where healthy people know that they need to maintain the boundaries. And I just that resonated with me as an HSP.

April Snow 14:23

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 14:24

And recognizing like the space that I want to provide for others.

April Snow 14:27

Boundaries are just part of relationships. I think we uh some people will interpret them as distance or a problem, but it's really just keeping the relationship healthy, balanced, right? Balanced, yes. Yes. Exactly. And we need to be able to confront people. I think HSPs struggle with that a lot. We're afraid of confrontation, of conflict.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 14:47

Yeah, I was guilty of that, yeah.

April Snow 14:49

Same. But I've seen just how it actually strengthens a relationship. So if you're not fighting, things are festering.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 15:01

Yes, that's right. Yeah.

April Snow 15:04

Yes.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 15:05

Yeah.

April Snow 15:05

So you've had quite the healing journey yourself, it sounds like really reflecting on your early years as a sensitive child and adolescent, and then bringing that into focus of what was going on and how the cultural elements in which greatly influence our experience of sensitivity. So I'm wondering how that influenced you now supporting others.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 15:27

Yes, yes. So currently in my life, right now, I am just have the privilege and honor to be a mother of two beautiful children, and I'm a wife of a wonderful civil servant. So I'll just keep it at that. He works for the city, and we both have high stress jobs. Yeah. In the sense of, and also where we're at in a family life cycle of parenting two young kids under four.

April Snow 15:52

Oh, yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 15:52

And I'm married to an introvert. He's an I'm an introvert.

April Snow 15:55

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 15:58

I have put a lot, how I show up for others is making sure that I pour into myself at home. This is me. I think about it as, and it's been off and on. Sometimes it's like I overextend myself, overfunction as it happens, because sometimes the body just does the body, does the thing, and sometimes it slows down. I had to learn the hard lesson, right? But how I show up for others is being able to pour a water can into myself like a plant, right? At home, right? I myself am an indoor plant. I need sunlight, right? I need to be outside, I need to have oxygen, so breathing, right? Being present, being mindful, and creating a structure and environment, a home where it's just safe to be.

April Snow 16:41

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 16:42

Like when you're growing up with two different homes, Louisiana here, Kansas there, this home is parented this way, this home is parented this way. You just you don't ever really have a standard, grounded. It's like growing up in a divorced family. Like there's just different rules apply differently, and you don't know what to expect. So I work with a lot of clients like that.

April Snow 17:04

Who are trying who have been disjointed or trying to navigate two different worlds at the same time. Yeah, it's a very tough transition for an HSP.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 17:14

And yeah, you're right. And so as far as like being a mother before I became a mom, I recognize I I have to heal first, start that healing journey. So then it's not harder for them to feel like they have to recover from childhood. Because childhood can be tough, it's can be difficult no matter how what the best intentions sometimes you just will make mistakes. But if you can be in be open right to building upon the op the knowing that maybe there is some work that I need to do, the reparenting piece. Yeah, setting up structure for myself, absolutely. So then I can show up for my clients and not be burnt out and take it out on them, take it out on my family at home. This is not fair, it's not right, it's not fair.

April Snow 18:00

You're in chowder is inherently stressful. It's a lot of development that's happening and inner exploration, but you can create a stronger foundation for your kids than what you had of grounded steadiness. Yeah. And so does this, I think this stems into your work with cycle breakers, would you say?

What It Means To Be A Cycle Breaker

April Snow 18:22

And could you tell folks a little bit about what that is? I think we've already alluded to it, but if we could define it for folks who maybe haven't heard that term before.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 18:30

Absolutely.

April Snow 18:31

Thank you.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 18:32

When we think about the term cycle breaker, it's being able to recognize that when I just had brunch with a friend of mine, a girlfriend of mine, who said it's not generational curses you're trying to break, it's in generational trauma, right? The trauma wounds. It's you saying, it's someone saying, just because this happened to this person doesn't mean it it stops here. Okay, and full stop. And that means also literally like undoing the work, requiring their brain, re-establishing a sense of clarity and connectedness to self unapologetically.

April Snow 19:17

Love that. Yeah, it's like I just think about this kind of just putting up a dam, right? And redirecting the river. Like we can go in a different direction from here. We don't have to continue these intergenerational patterns that we inherited.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 19:32

Because that's what it is, it's patterns.

April Snow 19:33

It's patterns, yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 19:35

Yeah, and as HSPs, we really thrive in understanding patterns. Dare I say, almost because there wasn't like consistent patterns, it's like I have to fill in a gap and recognize okay, if you grew up in a home where it was chaotic and confusing and unpredictable, right? So somewhere along the way, you had to learn to be aware of when daddy's moved us off. Or be understanding of some tension there. But now you're a grown person in your own house and you still feel keyed up and on edge. Maybe you didn't put pictures in the house because you don't feel like it's feel a connectedness to it. But you can cycle breaking is not just this old radical, do all the MDR sessions. It helps. I'm not gonna lie, make sure you'll accelerate.

April Snow 20:18

Yeah, but it's not it's not everything.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 20:19

It's not everything. Yeah.

April Snow 20:21

You bring up a good point. If you grew up feeling on edge, scared, have to be hyper-vigilant to whatever's happening and read the room at all times. Yeah, that doesn't just fade away as soon as you move into your own space. You're carrying those ghosts with you. And gosh, you even just the piece about hanging up the pictures. I remember reading this. There's a book about the nervous system. It was like people that grew up in those conditions, we just don't know how to live. That resonated with me a lot. Yeah, not doing simple things like settling into a space, hang up a photo, because what if you have to leave soon? Or on edge. But that can change. Doing the work and yeah, giving yourself permission to or maybe acknowledging that you're safe in your own home.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 21:05

Acknowledging. Well, you have to understand define safety and security.

April Snow 21:09

Different for everybody, but there's not to do that. Yeah. Yeah. Do you want to say more about how you did that?

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 21:21

Taylor Thomason, this amazing comedian, female comedian, like in her mid-20s. I'm sure people know from the audience. She talked about how the 20s are you're expected to fuck up.

April Snow 21:32

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 21:32

Like people expect you to mess up, fuck up. And so that resonated with me in the saying, okay. So I had permission, like looking back in my 20s, looking like doing all the things, like going out to clubs when I don't know what that's not my style. That's a very sensory overload, living with roommates when I don't like living with people I don't really genuinely care about. You know what I'm saying? That's the blunt me saying, I just don't. Yeah. I have this allergic reaction to being in an environment where it's too loud, too smelly, too many people, and yet I Just kept going.

April Snow 22:01

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 22:02

And this is supposed to do. You're supposed to do the fear of FOMO was real. And at the same time, it was learning, it was input, learning input. But again, your frontal lobe ain't lobin.

April Snow 22:13

Yep, not yet.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 22:16

So it was like, yes, I wish someone would have told me, like, I expect you to make mistakes and fuck up and learn along the way, but also, but then don't make too big of a mistake.

April Snow 22:26

Yep.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 22:26

Because redirect the path is just this way.

April Snow 22:29

But I don't have the privilege to mess up so much.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 22:33

Exactly.

April Snow 22:34

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 22:34

So I was just always all gas, no tank. All gas, no brakes, I should say. My 20s, and I just recognized like I have to just slow down, be intentional. And that looks like defining what security stability looks like, redefining it for myself. And some folks who might be listening might be say, What does she mean by that?

April Snow 22:56

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 22:56

I get that. Because you're like go chat to BT and you're like, security is this.

April Snow 23:02

Right. You could there's a standard definition, but yeah, it's different. How would you be able to share maybe one example of what security means for you? I think it's an idea.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 23:16

I would say an example of that for myself, how it presents as like being able to say I'm okay.

April Snow 23:27

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 23:28

I'm safe. I'm loved. I'm okay.

April Snow 23:35

And that's true. Maybe it wasn't before.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 23:41

Buddhist principal would say, yes, no, maybe. We don't know. We don't know why things happen the way they do. Yes, maybe there's a reason. Maybe. And there's this really great Japanese author, I'm doing out the name, but he wrote a lot on the male loneliness pandemic back in way back in the epidemic, I should say. Back in the late 80s. And he talked about, he said, pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.

April Snow 24:04

Oh, tit not han? Yeah. Yes.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 24:08

And that resonated with me so much because cycle breaking is saying the life is of pain. And it's an is inevitable, right? Yeah. The suffering, the internal struggles, the not recognizing that you need a release and to let go of guilt and understand that what happened as a kid was not okay.

April Snow 24:29

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 24:29

Or that maybe the adults in your life didn't have what they needed to make sure that you're okay, safe, secure. But you get to do that work now. Not too late. Not too late. And it just starts by just having the courage to still live a life worth living.

April Snow 24:49

Yeah. That's helpful. Like it even if it was hard before, it was hard yesterday, you still have time to find that safety, to say to yourself, I'm okay, I'm safe here, even if I wasn't safe then. Yeah. Yeah. That's powerful.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 25:11

I it's just as simple as saying. Because when you ask me, like security, because I'm still on that journey of okay, I know that if I can say there's a little part, there's a little, there's little me saying, am I okay? And big me saying, You are. I'm here. The four therapeutic powers of play says, I am here, I see you, I feel you. I see you. So those are the things. I see you, I hear you, I feel you, I'm here.

April Snow 25:37

That's what play is about. To yourself. I guess as an adult, you could say it to yourself. But as a play therapist, are you saying it to the kiddos you're working with? Yeah, beautiful. Yep. Yes. I love that. So I'm here, I see you, yeah, I'm safe. I am here. I am here. Yeah. It's so simple but so powerful. Just to, and like you said, it's a starting to rewire those messages, right? Reframe the messages, rewire your brain towards safety.

Rituals For Nervous System Care

April Snow 26:05

So, in your work as a play therapist and as a parent, I'm curious what practices do you bring in for the adults in those scenarios? You use a lot of mindfulness, grounding practices. You mentioned finding that safe, grounded space at home. What does that look like? Like, what are some of those practices?

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 26:25

Oh, yeah. As far as with my clients. Yeah, or yourself. Or myself. Yeah.

April Snow 26:29

So if for the sensitive cycle breakers out there who are wondering, what are the practices that I'm talking myself differently, but are there other things that I'm bringing in?

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 26:39

Oh, beautiful question. Practic it's practical, but I'll go up to my earlier earlier thing of treat yourself like an indoor plant.

April Snow 26:48

Love this metaphor.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 26:49

Or outdoor plant. What do they need? They need lots of sunlight. So you need vitamin D. Drink water. Making this is basic, but it's just those things, right?

April Snow 26:59

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 27:00

Grounded, go outside. That's what I like to do. I like to walk outside and feel my feet on the earth.

April Snow 27:06

Yep.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 27:07

To feel a sense of connected to my ancestors, right? Soil that they were on and being giving me thanks and everything like that. As well as just walking. So movement is medicine. Nature is medicine. And then being able to eat a nourishing meal. Right. That looks like I'm being more mindful of like anti-inflammatory diet, eating all the stuff that's colorful on my plate that's healthy.

April Snow 27:30

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 27:30

Yeah. Just and I think listening in, tuning in, tuning in to what I need. What is it that I need right now? For example, me having this conversation with you is very nourishing for me because it's my way of I'm able to connect to someone without having to over-explain or just me. I set the space up for this. Yeah. Because it was an intention. It was an act. I wanted to make sure this is these are the gun, these two things behind me are actually, if you can see here. Yeah. I don't know if they'll be able to see, but they're my, what do you call it? From the contrive. That's from where I'm from. And my mother got this from when she visited Ghana 30 years ago. And they are Kenticlop. So her grandmother wore this. And so this is what's behind me to keep me rooted and grounded. And then in the middle is my family, a multicultural family, me being married to an expat, my mom, my gunny, my British family, all the things, you know.

April Snow 28:30

Oh, that's so beautiful. These are your roots there in physical form. So important to have those symbols, those connection points. And I appreciate what you're saying about these pieces that are medicine. Because I think if you grew up in more of a chaotic or traumatic environment, I know from my own experience, those simple things were hard or they didn't get too much space. Hard to come by. So even just saying, what do I need now is a revelation. Because that was a luxury growing up.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 29:04

It was. What do I need now? Yeah. What do I not deserve? What do I have to earn? My body is giving me signals and telling me that April, it's as simple as me lighting an incense. I remember in grad school, I just started getting on the term of like self-care because it's just all the things, stress. And if you already come from a stress environment, you're like, okay, I'm just thrown into it. But I was like, okay, I actually need to shift the gears here and understand what that means, right? So I was making smoothies every day, or being able to. Someone told me once, like my roommate, she said, like, my I treated my room like a temple, which is like interesting. Because I was like, what do you mean by that? Because I would have, I would light my incense, grounding practice, look at the smoke, let it dissipate, you know what I mean? Read a book, low lights, light a candle, love white lighting candles, the Himalayan salt, just even just my eyes able to see, okay, this is soft, and it's helping me re-engage into my senses. And having my water on the side.

April Snow 30:09

Yeah, I love this. Just the intentionality, taking care of your senses, your nervous system. But deeper than that, having the rituals.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 30:17

I love that. Stability is routines, rituals. Yes, routines and rituals, routines and rituals. Rituals is not something that's like evil or whatever, some evil stuff. Exactly. It's just this consistent routine that allows me to pour into myself that regulates my nervous system.

April Snow 30:36

That's it. I think people get scared away by that term ritual, but it is. It's just these it's traditions, it's practices, right? It's the things that you do regularly for yourself or bringing that intentionality, bringing some sacred energy, something we need that as humans, and especially sensitive humans, something beyond ourselves.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 30:55

Sensitive souls.

April Snow 30:56

Yeah, exactly. We need something to pour into those souls. Yeah. This feels like you you maybe had that in you all along. It just tapping into it more.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 31:09

Yeah. It was always in me. I just just be honest, I just never really tapped into it because of just something else. Someone else needed something for me. Their needs was more important than mine, or this is how I can get love, or this is how I can secure something. But I recognize like I can't, I keep pouring from an empty cup.

April Snow 31:30

Yeah, I think you get to that point where you just realize I can't do that anymore. I'm at the bottom.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 31:36

And let's call it what it is. As a black woman in America, you know what I mean?

April Snow 31:40

You're beyond empty generations of emptiness. Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 31:43

And so living my softgore life, romanticizing my life. That's what those are things that my sisters and I have been talking about lately, because I do Marco Polo every day with my best friend. She lives out in DC. And that in itself is routine structured ritual that really helps me feel grounded and connected. Being able to talk verbally process out loud and just knowing that driving, driving helps me just regulate as well. But knowing that I am the work because we are the work, right? I do this work because I am a benefit, I am I am contributing to this community by helping little ones have a voice, have a space, feel connected, helping parents as they're parenting, helping adults who haven't even heard the term rest and rejuvenation relaxed, or knowing that they're at burnout, that they're at the danger of just crashing out.

April Snow 32:44

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 32:45

And they're like, I need a space to I love when clients come and say, I just need a space to deeply reflect what's going on. Just a space to be. Therapy is dead. Yes, to be held. My feelings can be held softly and can be seen with gentle and tenderness that we all deserve.

April Snow 33:02

Yeah, and creating that safe space somewhere. That could be the first safe space, the therapy room, potentially. And I just want to go back to something you said, which is really important, which is you don't have to earn those spaces. You don't have to earn that self-care. And yeah, you can start here. So you're cycle breaking for yourself, for your family, with your kids. You're helping others cycle break, learn to reparent themselves, parent their own children differently than they were parented.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 33:33

Noticing and understanding and leaning with curiosity about it, not with judgment, just with curiosity.

Curiosity Reparenting And Inner Safety

April Snow 33:39

What's important about being curious, not judgmental?

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 33:44

Curiosity offers a sense of freedom and liberation in the sense of because we and we're all born with it. Kids are naturally childlike, curious. I love when kids ask why, why, why? Because that's a kid who's seeking and understanding their world and trying to get input. And when you look at it from a judgment place like why me, why this? It's you undoing, you're putting an unhealthy amount of guilt. You're putting this unexpected, unrealistic expectation on yourself to have understood everything that happened to you. Now, what it's not why that happened, what happened, right? Dr. Push Prairie talked about with Oprah and stuff. But curiosity is that's been something that's been a strength of mine. Like I've dare I say value.

April Snow 34:28

Value, yeah. Makes sense, right? Something that you hold in esteem. And yeah, instead of criticizing, we can be curious. What do I need? What happened to me? It's softer.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 34:41

It's softer. It's again the reparenting, the bicycle breaking processes, being able to tell talk to your inner child and say, I know you're scared. Yeah, I know you're not understanding why your body your brain is sending signals to your body to say these things all the time. And now I am the adult to say it's okay. And I get it. And you're right to feel scared. And you're right to be questioning why is this happening? What's going on? And it and you didn't deserve it, and you don't deserve it. But let's softly walk away, play with a toy, connect with me, and be seen.

April Snow 35:27

Yeah, it's so powerful. You can say that to me every day.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 35:32

Honestly, my mission in life is to like look to help others feel seen, loved, and supported. If I had to just be real blunt with you and be like, okay, the niche and stuff, it's like I help people break the no, I want people to feel love, seen, supported. If this is their first time not feeling it, I want to be able to give them offer a space that's warm, inviting, curious, kind, so then it can allow your body and your brain to say, okay, perhaps I could lean into being softer to myself. Perhaps I didn't deserve what happened, even though the narrative is saying these things. And maybe I could also rewrite the story. Maybe look at the generational gifts I got versus the generational trauma. It's a both. I came from a highly structured, matriarchal, beautiful home. No matter what, no matter what was going on, I came from a matriarchal, highly independent, amazing women who poured love into us the best way they can with what they had and still showed up.

April Snow 36:53

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 36:54

Full stop. Still showed up. And I'm doing that for my kids. And it's gonna look different. And they may say there was things I wish you could have done differently. And I have to be open to that. I'm open and curious to that. I don't have to like it. Right. But I know it's gonna happen. If they're gonna be in somebody's therapist's office, I'm like, the least they can say was I had a too good childhood, though.

April Snow 37:21

Slip the other way.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 37:23

My almost two understandings. That's not what I wish. But anyway, I can talk, I can ramble.

April Snow 37:30

Oh no, this is beautiful. But even in all in the chain, it seems like you're holding those roots, those values in place in a different package.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 37:40

In a different package, which is really beautiful.

April Snow 37:43

And just a reminder that it's not all bad. We can look at the nuance, which I know is hard, can take a long time to do that.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 37:49

It does, yeah.

April Snow 37:51

But there's maybe some nuggets in there that you want to keep. But yeah, change the narrative, change the packaging. Yeah.

People Pleasing And Self Acceptance

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 37:58

Anger a long time clouded my anger, resentment, frustration, and just injustices. Because when you're HSP, you have a highly sensitive high sensitivity to any injustice, all injustices, injustices. And when for a long time, if you've been that vocal, outspoken child who's also highly sensitive, always put the kibosh on.

April Snow 38:22

Yeah.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 38:22

At some point, you just I also I can't wait to say this, but the biggest thing I really, my biggest takeaway was like, I don't like everybody. Everybody don't gotta like me. Why am I people pleasing for people who's the people all over you? Okay. Yes. Like, maybe I should start doing the opposite. Like, I was just tired of like people pleasing, fawning, not making shipments of my words or blunt and have to say sorry and feeling bad all the time. I just said, okay, let me just try the other thing of what if it's just I like me and that's enough. I like who I am as I am.

April Snow 38:58

That's it. Because if you like yourself, everything else is gonna be okay.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 39:02

It's gonna be okay. But for a long time, I didn't think I could or should or there's something to fix before I can like myself. And I'm like, no, I am fine the way I am. I'm a good friend, wife, everything like that, mother. I try my best. I'm willing to, there's a difference. I'm willing to accept fault when fault is there.

April Snow 39:21

Important.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 39:22

And then also know that if I'm asking questions like, am I a good parent? That just the fact that I'm asking that that's already that's it.

April Snow 39:30

When if you're asking those questions, you already know everything's gonna be okay. It's when you're not asking the questions that you're in a dangerous spot when it's not even on your radar. Angela, we have to start to wrap up, but this has been such a good conversation. I feel like I've known you for years.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 39:48

Same, same, really. Yeah.

How To Work With Angelique

April Snow 39:50

Truly. I'm wondering if there's any final messages you have for the listeners who are sensitive cycle breakers themselves.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 39:56

Yes. Oh, we're worthy of the love that you give to others. So go ahead and take care of yourself. Know that you don't have to all figured out. Be curious, love others, love yourself, and be kind to your mind.

April Snow 40:15

Thank you for that. It's such a good reminder that you can send that empathy back in and you can start today. Thank you for that. You're welcome. For anyone who wants to work with you, which I highly recommend, uh I'll share all of your resources in the show notes, your website, your social media. You often teach workshops, so folks can find those there.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 40:39

That's right.

April Snow 40:40

I'm excited to do virtual workshops, thank you. So anywhere in the world. Yep. Beautiful, love that. And so can you tell listeners a little bit more about working with you if they're interested in coming to see you for therapy or engaging with your other offerings?

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 40:54

Absolutely. So I offer individual therapy for adults. I will do play therapy for kiddos from three to 11, as well as starting to see teens.

April Snow 41:04

Wonderful.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 41:05

Yep. And the way best way can get to me, obviously, if you live in Kansas or Missouri, because I'm licensed there, that'd be great. But I also offer virtual coaching workshops or coaching sessions for those who live out of state to talk about caregiving. If you're caregiving for an older adult or a child and you just want a space to talk and connect, you can do virtual that way. And then I'm located in the Midwest Midtown West Porter area in Kansas City and opening for practice. Please feel free to visit the website. I also do speak engagements. Happy to talk to your school, your retreat, your corporate retreats, to talk about creativity and play therapy.

April Snow 41:42

I love it. So many beautiful offerings folks can tap into. Because yeah, if you're caregiving, if you're trying to navigate some of these pieces, it's helpful to have a space with someone who gets it.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 41:53

Absolutely. You're not alone. You're not alone. Even if it feels alone. It's very islative being a caregiver. It is. Absolutely. It can be. So just have a space to dedicate it to talk about all the things.

April Snow 42:05

Yeah, and you can create a safe space for them.

Angelique Foye-Fletcher 42:08

That's right.

April Snow 42:08

Yeah, I love it. Thank you so much.

Subscribe Reviews And Resources

April Snow 42:16

Thanks so much for joining me and Angelique for today's conversation. What I hope you remember is that even if you didn't grow up being encouraged to embrace your sensitivity or to prioritize your needs, you can start now. It's never too late. If you need space and support to reset, join Angelique for one of her rest and rejuvenate virtual sessions or work with her on one-to-one. All details are on her website at foyerfletcherapy.com, Foyer spelled F-O-Y-E. All links are in the show notes. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to the Sensitive Stories podcast so you don't miss our upcoming conversations. Reviews and ratings are also helpful and appreciated. For behind the scenes content and more HSP resources, you can sign up for my email list or follow Sensitive Strengths on Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube. Check out the show notes or sensitivestories.com for all the resources from today's episode. Thanks for listening.